Episode Transcript
[00:00:00] Speaker A: Hello and welcome to Lead with Heart. I AM your host, Dr. Jesse Hansen. And today I find myself in a little cute beach town of Dominical in the southern part of Costa Rica. And we are heading in to Dualia Clinic and Bathhouse. Check out some of these amazing treatment spaces that these beautiful rooms welcome. This amazing organic lighting. I definitely would love to have a massage in here. If we come over to this side, there's another great little room right in here. Traditional Chinese medicine and energy healing, all sorts of alternative therapies are being welcomed. And again and just feeling the vibe already, it's just so peaceful just walking in. Another thing I'm learning to appreciate about Diwali is not only the holistic and
[00:00:38] Speaker B: alternative, but also the medical and the
[00:00:40] Speaker A: clinical IV treatments and other medical treatments. Again, we'll learn more about later today. Part of the reason why I chose to come here today to do Alia is because it is a place of health and wellness. Lead With Heart is more than just leadership. It's about living the best version of ourselves. And so this is an environment that supports that.
This is an amazing outdoor shower. Before or after the saunas? Before, after whatever treatments I'm getting here. Able to come out here and just really feel held by this beautiful wooden structure as also cleansing physical body. So the final part of this tour will take us through this space to actually be able to see the amazing set that we are going to be working with today. Set out here in nature. On this side of me I have these amazing cold plunges which are ancient way but again it's becoming popular again a way to help regulate our nervous system, do deeper inner focused work. Probably my most favorite thing about Dualia is their sauna. Oh, smells so good in here. And this is a traditional style of using heated electric coils to heat these rocks and pour the water on. It is and it's a way that we can bring that back into our modern life. Here at Dualia they found a way to weave it in and just reminding everyone that we're only maybe 500 meters from the beach right here. We're in the middle of a bustling little beach town. Thank you so much for tuning in today. Another amazing set and setting that we can all do our part to.
[00:02:00] Speaker B: Lead With Heart.
Welcome to Lead with heart. I'm Dr. Jesse Hanson and today we explore the essence of leadership beyond strategy and status. You're watching now Media Television.
[00:02:40] Speaker A: Hello and welcome to Lead with Heart. The show where strategy meets soul. I AM your host, Dr. Jesse Hanson and today my guest is Ross McKenzie, the Chief Authenticity Officer at RossMackenzie.com, an empathetic facilitator and relational somatic counselor who supports people through trauma, life transitions, and what he calls the dark nights of the soul. He brings a multidisciplinary lens, somatic work, mindfulness and coaching practices grounded in creating a safe, confidential container where people can actually metabolize what they've been carrying.
So thank you, Ross, for being here on the show down here in Costa Rica.
[00:03:18] Speaker C: Thanks for having me, Jesse.
[00:03:19] Speaker A: My honor. And beyond the official intro that I just gave, also acknowledging to our viewers, I've actually known Ross now for about 12 years and we met at a time where I was launching a healing center in Toronto, Canada, and Ross was getting ready to launch his film, which we're going to learn more about later in this conversation today. So just exciting to bring it all forward and to look back on the 12 years we've known each other. And I've seen you going through your process of becoming even more in your leadership role. And when we get deeper into this and viewers understanding what Ross has been through to get where you are, it's definitely a story for me that sings of lead with heart. So thank you so much for being a walking embodiment of this. And the first segment is about the seed, the, the origins where you, who were you, where you came from? So share what you're willing to share with us, Ross.
[00:04:07] Speaker C: Cool. Well, thanks, Jesse. Yeah, so, yeah, basically grew up just outside Toronto, place called Mississauga.
Great family, two older sisters, father who was like a big businessman.
And so, yeah, life was for the most part, all good. I can also say too, my father, who was just this incredibly successful man, also dealing with an enormous amount of trauma.
And so I was then very early on, I was going to a boarding school, super high academics, very stressful. And that was very early on. Starting I was dealing with a lot of anxiety and even depression just from the pressure cooker of what that is.
Fast forward. I left that school at about age 17 and then went to finish high school in Connecticut.
Great experience. And that launches me to where I'm going to school and college in upstate New York.
[00:04:53] Speaker A: I want to jump in really quick, slow down, because I think it's one important thing all of us think about is like, what role did we carry in our family of origin? And, you know, I admit I know your story a bit more than I often do, but I don't know how you would name it.
[00:05:05] Speaker C: Well, I mean, I guess I would call My role as like wounded healer. Like. I know, I know, I know. I was coming in to break the chains of dysfunction, you know. And you know, I also joined forces with my two older sisters because we've always linked arms and done a lot of work together.
[00:05:18] Speaker A: And wasn't there a truth to it though? Like I agree with you, wounded healer. It emerges. But in those younger years, you know, you mentioned your father being so established and all that, but I was going to offer the role that's often called golden boy or golden one.
[00:05:32] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, yeah. I mean that's what my sisters referred to me as. The golden child.
[00:05:35] Speaker A: Right. So yeah, usually we hear what our siblings will say about us. They're going to say our role. Oh, you were always the good one or you were the bad one or you were the golden one. Right, Totally. So the highlight of that, right, Ross, is that, you know, lots of beautiful things and you were, you know, athletic and success in every way except the hard part of being about the golden boy is the pressure. Right.
[00:05:55] Speaker C: And the expectation at your huge expectations. Yeah, huge, huge.
[00:06:00] Speaker A: So let's. Yeah, let's as viewerships. Listening and I'm listening. Let's hold that in our hearts for you as we learn you better though it was very blessed. There was also unspoken pressure that you were under to, to continue to be the golden boy and keep up with dad's accolades and prowess.
[00:06:17] Speaker C: Totally.
[00:06:18] Speaker A: Right. So that. Yeah, okay. So as that, that's sort of the undertone energy in there. Bring us forward now to. You're saying Connecticut.
[00:06:24] Speaker C: And, and yeah, so went to Connecticut, finished high school there. I had a great experience and then I found myself.
Ended up in college in upstate New York. It was just about, it was just over the Buffalo borders, about three hours from Toronto and actually got in for hockey. But when I got in there, I ended up sidestepped hockey. I just went to the coach. I'm playing soccer here. Soccer was my other sport. So I got to play with these amazing guys. We were this no name school in soccer and we ended up my second year, sophomore year. So we ended up becoming like number one in the country.
Had the time of our lives. It was just one of those like moments where everything was in a flow state and we were all in a flow state together. It was magical.
So from that experience, so literally I was high on a high heisen height and feeling great. And then that winter I crashed. I was having big cycles at that point.
[00:07:11] Speaker A: So in some ways to say some of that pressure was starting to.
[00:07:14] Speaker C: The pressure, the traumas that were building and I was just so. Yeah, so it almost like there was, there was not a lot of balance. It was like I would kind of ride high like in a soccer season like that. And then I would just crash. And so I'm crashed that winter, it's cold, it's upstate New York. I'm not even really going to classify.
But I found myself getting into a program where it was two professors taking 35 of us to a program in New York City. So I finished that semester and at that time too, what was also happening simultaneously? I'd asked my dad, I said, gosh, I've seen this guy, Anthony Robbins on tv. I really want to go to this Firewalk seminar. So for my birthday, for my 21st birthday, he buys me this firewalk seminar. So I end up, I know that I'm going to New York City, but prior to that I fly to Chicago, I'm at a Marriott hotel, there's like 1500 people and it was called Firewalk Seminar. So that first night in this big auditorium, he's basically using neuro linguistic programming. Basically putting us on a hypnotic.
[00:08:13] Speaker A: Tony Ross.
[00:08:13] Speaker C: Yeah, yeah, he's brilliant. He's brilliant. So six hours, he's like, listen guys, they're raking the coals out in the parking lot. You're going to go out there at midnight, you're going to walk in this hotbed of coals and you realize when you get on that other side, you can do anything, you're unstoppable. And he just repeated that. Well, he's got us in an NLP trance.
We get out there at midnight, I'm super stoked. I'm like second in line. I walk about across this hotbed of coals. It's like walking across a hotbed of popcorn. Felt fantastic. And on the other side of this 12 foot bed of hot coals, I literally feel. And it was like a switch. It just went from off to on. And I'm just like in this euphoric state of blissful ecstasy. That was incredible.
And I'm just riding this wave. And so that night I didn't sleep, wake up well, didn't even wake up. So Saturday morning, go back in, you know, everyone's waking up, having breakfast. So I go into Saturday, he's doing the rest of the seminar. Saturday, Saturday night I didn't sleep.
Not eating in a way.
[00:09:09] Speaker A: Still kind of buzzing from this activation
[00:09:12] Speaker C: and just like totally, totally buzzing from this like I guess, I mean the transcendent shamanic initiation I guess is what it was.
You know, it was only years later that I started to look and see. Wow, that was actually a Kundalini awakening. It was like a spiritual awakening.
So Sunday night I don't sleep. The program finishes and I stay up that whole night. And that next morning I'm flying from Chicago back to Toronto and my father's picking me up in Toronto. We're having lunch and then he's taking me back to the airport, which we did. My father didn't really recognize me because I was pretty much like a kind of a shy, pretty laid back kid. And he's seen this gregarious, like totally like taking charge kind of guy. He enjoyed it, but he was confused. And so we have lunch. Takes me back to the airport and now I'm flying to New York City. I get to New York City, we're staying in the Vanderbilt ymca. I meet my other students.
Now it's Monday, but Monday I decide to go out and be with the homeless in New York City because I was on this while I was feeling this intense euphoria and bliss. I was on a mission to like save the world. So I'm going out, I'm meeting all the homeless. I had a little bit of money in my bank account. I'm taking the money out, I'm like handing my money out to the homeless. I'm hugging them, I'm like, everything's going to be okay. And but all the while I'm losing weight, I'm not eating, so nutritional deficiency. And so I think it was a Tuesday now.
And my sister, who was having to be a family therapist at the time, she just graduated University of Miami. And she's like, oh my goodness, my son, my brother's in a manic episode. So she says, listen, I need your help. Because she was seeing that I was trying to help everyone.
So I grabbed my wallet, get in the cab, go to JFK airport, I buy myself a one way ticket to your sister.
[00:10:55] Speaker A: Sort of cleverly uses, yeah, use some
[00:10:58] Speaker C: like awesome like manipulation to just be like, oh my God, let's just get him back here. So while I'm in this flight back to Toronto, they're setting up a psychiatric intervention for me. So I landed Toronto.
My sister was pretty stunned because I think at that point I probably lost like about like 10 to 15 pounds in a very short amount of time.
And so gets there, she's like, listen, will you do this for me? We're just, we're going to go to this hospital. Just wanted them to evaluate you, check you. So I get there My parents are there, my GP doctor is there, my other sister is there. And I said, listen, I will stay here. I'll go in, but I'm not going to allow you to medicate me.
I was in there for one night, still not sleeping. In there for a second night, still not sleeping, still not eating.
And it was about day two that this.
I felt like I was like the welcoming committee. I was still in this place of wanting to help everyone, but there I was, clearly not balanced myself. This woman comes in who is clearly off her meds and dealing with schizophrenic symptoms, and went up to her and she just. You know, it's actually a scene in the film, which we'll talk about a little bit later. But she ended up saying, you know, sometimes I have these happy tears, sad tears. Sometimes I have these acid tears come out of my eyes and burn holes into my skin.
That totally freaked me out. At this point, I'm looking at very much a good. Good and evil type thinking.
I ran out the door, escaped from the hospital, bare feet. It's zero degrees outside.
I'm now running out of the front door of the hospital in my hospital clothes with the only thought, rich, I can still. I can remember it all crystal clear to this day. I was like, I gotta get to South America. I gotta go away from that woman, and then I'll be okay. And that's my only thought process. So I crossed the highway. I remember almost getting hit by many cars.
And now I'm thinking, oh, geez. I just. Gosh, I'm in hospital clothes. I'm in Bedford. I gotta get to the airport.
I ended up banging on these people's door. They let me in. I called my therapist at the time, who was the one person I was probably closest to, and I asked her to pick me up.
And then I escape out of this door these lovely people like having. We actually did a recreation scene of this in the film 20 years later, which was so wild.
But I busted through the doors. They tried to catch me.
Dogs are looking for me. The police are looking for me. Police apprehend me as I'm basically walking naked across a highway overpass. The 403 overpass saga.
[00:13:24] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:13:25] Speaker C: And, yeah, placed in a straight jacket, thrown in a white padded room. Pump Full of Hell doll. The strongest antipsychotic known to man.
But here was the really cool part in that experience, because it was in Peak Fight or flight, and I get put in a straitjacket. So you couldn't have something more extreme.
And I Had this very, still to this day, the most profound spiritual experience I've ever had in my life where I get the sense that whether it was an NDE near death experience or something, but my soul was in some form of protection. And I feel like it shot out of the body just because of just the extreme nature of what I was dealing with.
I found myself just kind of conversing with these benevolent beings are like, we're gonna put you back in.
You're gonna go on a journey. You're gonna get to the bottom of this ordeal that you're dealing with right now. And when you do, you're gonna be in a place to educate.
And I wasn't given a time frame, but I remember I didn't. And I was like, fighting, like, I don't want to go back in. So, you know, I get put back in, I wake up. What was so cool when I opened my eyes in this hospital room is that my therapist at the time, she's right in my face. Her name is Irma Perrin. She's right in my face. And I look at her and I go, I was just in the light. She goes, I know. I'm here to welcome you back.
[00:14:45] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:14:46] Speaker C: My parents, my sisters were behind her and they're like, oh, shit. It's really off his rocker now. Yeah, yeah, yeah.
[00:14:51] Speaker A: She's like, oh, don't encourage him, Ross. Let me say, this is so beautiful, man. Now thank you for opening up with such vulnerable shares about super powerful experiences. We're gonna have to take a quick break. When we come back, we're gonna continue to stay tuned with Ross's story and learn more about where he's becoming from this place that sounds like, how do you. How does one transmute all that into this life? So stay tuned. We'll be back with more soon.
[00:15:18] Speaker B: We'll be right back with more insight stories and practices to help you lead from your whole self. This is Lead with Heart on NOW Media Television.
Leadership isn't just about decisions. It's about presence, compassion, and courage.
I'm Dr. Jesse Hanson, somatic psychologist and healer. And on Lead with Heart, we explore what happens when we lead with awareness, compassion, and the body in mind.
From brain health to relational intelligence, from trauma informed leadership to embodied teams, each episode reveals a deeper way to lead.
Lead with Heart is airing now on NOW Media tv. Because the greatest leaders don't just guide people, they awaken them.
[00:16:08] Speaker A: And we're back.
[00:16:09] Speaker B: I'm Dr. Jesse Hanson, and you're watching Lead with Heart on Now Media Television. Let's continue embracing leadership with presence and purpose.
[00:16:19] Speaker A: Hello and welcome back.
Want more of what you're watching? Stay tuned to Lead with Heart and all your Now Media favorites by downloading the Now Media app on iOS or Android. We're also on Apple TV Roku. You can find us through podcast formatting on Apple and Spotify, iHeartRadio. All the great. So please stay tuned and I'm gonna bring us back now here to this beautiful episode of Lead with Heart. Thank you, Ross McKenzie for being here right before the break we were leaving. Off with Ross is telling a very compelling story, very vulnerable. Thank you. And as even though I selfishly I already know that the sequence of this moving it through the story, it's just to think for a second, wow, like, here you are, I mean, basically what a lot of people would consider screwed, you know, a victim of the mental health care system as well as now getting in custody with the police. So let's move. This segment is all about, you know, you know, taking us forward from there into who you are becoming.
[00:17:15] Speaker C: Right.
[00:17:15] Speaker A: And make sure to hit the good juicy points on the way there, you know.
[00:17:19] Speaker C: Cool. Yeah. So, I mean, so basically from that point, I was, I realized that things were out of balance.
And so I, I was given a bipolar diagnosis. At that point, I was told I was going to have to take lithium, take lithium for the rest of my life to, to manage these symptoms. I had a chemical imbalance.
And you know, at that point, because of the whole experience that I was just in, I bought into that. And at the same time that I bought into it, I also had that very profound experience in the straight jacket and kind of that, that light experience
[00:17:55] Speaker A: leaving body like some would call like nde, like a near death experience, near
[00:17:58] Speaker C: the experience, whatever you want to call it.
So, so I was kind of sitting with both at the same time. And you know, and I'm so grateful for that light experience because if it wasn't for that, I could have literally succumbed to a life of diagnosis, medication and not really doing the work. But what it did is it propelled me to go on a journey and I really did from that point forward. And I was kind of obsessed with trying all things mind, body, spirit, approach to addressing symptoms.
And I did that for many, many years.
All the while I was taking 900 milligrams of lithium every night. And I remember I take the dose at night. I'd wake up in the morning. I always felt like I had been hit by a truck.
You know, like symptoms of brain fog, tiredness Lethargy.
It was just like waking up. So that was from, like 21 all the way through to age, like, 38.
And during that time, there was two times, I think one of them was around age 34, and the other one was around age 36, where I actually went to go cold turkey off of lithium because the side effects are so brutal.
My life, I was, you know, I was teaching yoga, I was doing some acting, but I was also like, there's times where I couldn't do either of those. You know, I'd call my agent, be like, they were like, we have an audition for him. Like, I can't go out. You know, depression, anxiety. And so it was just this very difficult stuff while I was doing the work.
Fast forward to, you know, I'm at a seminar in Vegas and I'm watching this woman, Gwen Olson, who was a pharmaceutical whistleblower, speak.
And the first two times prior to this, first two times before Vegas, I went to go off lithium. And this is a really important point for the listeners is that you do not want to go off these medications cold turkey, because in both times I went off them, I had severe chemical withdrawal. The symptoms that I had came on way worse.
And it's a tricky, challenging thing because the system's kind of set up where you were told at the beginning by your doctor, like, listen, going to stay on these for life. You need these for life. And so when you go off and you're realizing you've got the symptoms underneath, but you've also got chemical withdrawal, it's a double whammy. So both times, very horrific, tough years. But this third time, when I meet this woman, Gwen Olson, she's like, listen, there's a little place in Costa Rica they can help you to detox off of lithium. You've got treatments, you've got massage, you've got some, like, good food, you've got nature of Costa Rica. So I remember, I was like, okay, this is it. I'm doing it. I'm doing it this time.
My father had already just passed.
My mother, you know, blessed my mother and blessed my sisters because they always, despite the challenges they'd seen me go through, they always trusted me. And I said, listen, Mom, I got it this time. And I know she was terrified because she saw the first two times I tried to get off lithium, but she's like, okay, you got this. So I went down there. February 2010, and March 18, 2010, was the last time I ever took. Lick him.
[00:20:56] Speaker A: Wow. So six weeks detox, six weeks now
[00:20:59] Speaker C: in hindsight, I was pulled off too fast, you know, but still I was so committed. I wasn't, I wasn't going back to that life.
And then the next leg, the next chapter of the work really began. But the cool thing was, is that I realized until I got off of it, my life force started to come back. Like, it was only then that I really realized, like, wow, this was. I was so sedated that I didn't even have access or the energy to do the work to get to the cause of the symptoms. So now it's like, okay, I've got some energy back here.
[00:21:31] Speaker A: I'm gonna jump real quick. Because you're bringing up such great points, I just want to make sure to highlight them through your own story. How it impacts others is that I know as a psychologist, I've had so many people come to me over the decades of wanting to get off medications but not feeling like they, that there's a real legitimate path or even knowing how to do it. So just first of all, for other viewers that may either know that personally or anyone that is, that they know in their families or friendships is that, you know, you are living proof and a walking billboard that it is possible.
And also that, you know, we're going to kind of go into this as we branch into the deeper sections of this conversation, Ross. But that it's the balance of everything we have to do physiological detox mixed with understanding when we have a chemical imbalance. You know, that that's an easy cop out saying, but the truth is that our emotional patterns create our biochemistry.
[00:22:20] Speaker C: Totally.
[00:22:20] Speaker A: Right. Influenced by genetics and epigenetics, however, mostly influenced by behaviors. Right. And belief structures. So yeah, I'm just loving where you're coming from in that. That you already have that awareness to do the deeper work as well as keep working through the medical side of things. And, and as your story is unfolding and I admit, you know, again, I know some of it, but this is also where I always want to acknowledge you. To me, this is another example of leadership is you realize this isn't just about you. You knew that you were not the only one going through something like this that maybe had been misdiagnosed or over prescribed and that I'm appreciating that you had the insight to know that and that you actually connected with Bell Media in Canada.
Sorry, yes. And was able to have this whole thing documented and, and some of it's reenacted, some of it's documented. But to tell your story.
[00:23:11] Speaker C: Right.
[00:23:11] Speaker A: I just love this Part of your story as well. Because by doing that, not only that, you know, adds in a little bit of fun, of course, of, like, what you're going through is now being witnessed more. But really it's you. So that you can be here with me now telling the story so that you have your documentary to help other people realize that there's a way through all this.
[00:23:28] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:23:28] Speaker A: Right.
[00:23:29] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:23:29] Speaker A: So thank you for that amazing service
[00:23:31] Speaker C: and so grateful I got to do that.
[00:23:33] Speaker A: And so. Okay. Yeah. So to come back into your story now, you're. Yeah, you're. You're getting clean. You're starting to basically have relativity and realize without lithium being constantly pumped into you, which is a toxin, you're like, oh, I'm starting to feel like I'm actually a human.
[00:23:46] Speaker C: Yeah. Starting to feel human. Starting to feel my energy come back. Having energy to do the work. Yeah. And, yeah, thanks for bringing up the film because at the same time, I was like, wow, this. This is so much bigger than me. I gotta. I gotta put this out there. And so I. I started. I was in Costa Rica. I met the woman who.
Who is now my wife and the mother of my children at that same time.
And so I was. I was. I was living with her in San Jose and I was doing research, what I thought was to be a book. And. And then, lo and behold, two, three months later, I get this phone call from this kind of acquaintance back in Toronto. And she's like, I've heard kind of through the grapevine about your story. She said, have you thought about doing a documented film? And I'm like. And it was just like this light bulb went off.
And so, yeah, I literally. I said to Monica at the time, I said, listen, I gotta go back to Toronto. I have to explore this.
And that was the. That was 2000, end of 2010. And so there I was going back and started writing this thing and. And then found a director, dop. And we started just shooting this thing guerrilla style, putting together a trailer, and it was just so much fun. I look back, it was one of the most exciting times of my life because I was so asleep, sleep for so long. And here I was, like, coming back to life and realizing, oh, my gosh, I get to do this project now. So we shoot this thing, we're putting it out there, and I'm like, this is going to cost some money. So I. I had this list, and I was going down the list, and the last person on my list was this guy I went to grade school and high school with. And nursery school with. And he was a financial analyst. I'm like, all right, I'll make one last call.
So I call him up, calls me into lunch. He's like, so let me get this straight, Ross.
Well, I was building a career, becoming a financial analyst, having a kids, having a family. You were going through this all these years? I'm like, yep. He's like, all right, here's what I'm going to do. I'm going to put some funds in a trust. I don't want to be the only investor. And then I'm also going to. I happen to be best friends with the CEOs of the two cable companies in town. So I'm going to call one and if they don't respond, let me know and then I'll call the other one.
And so he calls me up a month later and he's like, have you heard from John? I'm like, no, I haven't heard. He's like, all right, calling the other one. No promises here, we'll see what happens.
An hour later I get a phone call like, are you Ross McKenzie? I said, yep. She's like, my name is Sarah Jane Flynn, VP of film. Your film has been greenlit. Can you be in here at 8am tomorrow? And I just like, I just remember I collapsed, I hit the floor and I've got my co producer I'm writing with and she's like in tears. And so we walk in, it was so funny because this woman, Sarah James Finn, she like walking and she shuts the door. She's like, who the F are you?
She goes, I just got a top down order to greenlight your film, which has never happened in the history of my career or anyone else's career. Who the F are you? Right, so I'm sitting there, I'm like, well, just 20 years of hard work, luck and timing and I'm here to tell this story.
So anyways, we ended up getting along. She was great and she gave me three companies that I was to go interview in Toronto.
And I did that and I ended up picking. Well, I got so fortunate. I got to pick and work with like one of the top documentary filmmakers in Canada. And he wanted to tell my story.
And so it was just that we made this film where I tell. Basically it's like a mind, body, spirit approach to addressing mental health with psychiatrists and investigative journalists and pharmaceutical whistleblowers and the whole bit. But the whole intention of it was really, it wasn't, you know, I'm at a place Now I wasn't in a place then, but I'm a place now. I'm imbalanced with it all. I was so angry at the system then. Not angry at the system anymore. There's a place for these meds, you
[00:27:12] Speaker A: know, they have their place.
[00:27:13] Speaker C: They do have their place, you know, so I'm not against it, but it was just more that I just wanted to tell the story so that people had an option because I think so many people just think about the one dimensional approach. And I just wanted this film to be a conversation, start to be like, hey, if you look at your whole self, the whole person, the mind, the body, the spirit, I truly believe that all people can, you know, really address their symptoms.
So that's, that's the story. That, that's why, that's why I did it.
[00:27:39] Speaker A: Wow.
[00:27:39] Speaker C: To do it.
[00:27:40] Speaker A: Wow.
So exciting. And then for our viewers, yeah, we'll make sure to dial it in properly. But yeah, you can actually watch Ross's his whole film Bipolarized. And we'll tell more about that soon. We are going to have to take a quick break here, Ross. Before we do, I just want to name one other insight too that you said. You know, I as well, though I'm very much into alternative and holistic psychopharmacological medications do have their place in treatment, in the society, in this world, and they're here whether we like it or not. So we might as well learn how to make friends with them.
And I offer that in your story at least, and maybe others who are listening. It was not even yes, the lithium was numbing and all that, but it was also that moment where instead of slowing down and looking at you as a mind, body, spirit, human, and saying, why is this happening and what can we do to support this guy emotionally? It was a quick label diagnosis and kill and that was the end of it. And that's to me, the main thing that we need to help wake up in the system.
[00:28:40] Speaker B: We'll be right back with more insight stories and practices to help you lead from your whole self. This is Lead with Hart on NOW Media Television.
Leadership isn't just about decisions. It's about presence, compassion and courage.
I'm Dr. Jesse Hanson, somatic psychologist and
[00:29:02] Speaker A: healer, and on Lead with Heart we
[00:29:04] Speaker B: explore what happens when we lead with awareness, compassion and the body in mind.
From brain health to relational intelligence, from trauma, informed leadership to embodied teams, each episode reveals a deeper way to lead.
Lead with Heart is airing now on NOW Media tv. Because the greatest leaders don't just guide people they awaken them.
[00:29:30] Speaker A: And we're back.
[00:29:31] Speaker B: I'm Dr. Jesse Hansen and you're watching Lead with Heart on Now Media Television. Let's continue embracing leadership with presence and purpose.
[00:29:40] Speaker A: Hello and welcome back to Lead with Heart. On this segment, we are going to go deeper into the lotus, the process of transformation itself.
Our guest today, Ross McKenzie, he's been open up very beautifully, vulnerably about what sounds like a very wild ride and a tough story to get through through. So thankfully we're at the part of the story to hear more about how you start transforming. So take it away. Cool.
[00:30:02] Speaker C: So, I mean, first off, the making of the film, it was about a year process. It was six months of writing and then it was a year of shooting.
And it was phenomenal. And I really say it was like the shooting of it, the experience of it, the completion of it was like, it was so cathartic. You know, I feel like there was so much healing that got to take place by actually going into the action of making to film.
And then from there it was really cool. I actually got to do the first screen of the film when it was finished in San Jose, Costa Rica. So that happened there and then started, you know, touring it around festivals. And for me, that was one of the most exciting parts because it was mostly around the U.S. it did air across Canada, November 1, 2014, on national television, which was cool. But for me, the real gem was like actually being out there showing the film.
[00:30:50] Speaker A: You do discussions, favorite part was engaged people.
[00:30:52] Speaker C: Yeah, the film would finish and then it was just like, it was like live Q and A right after. And that was just so extraordinary because it's just like, you know, my whole thing is like, listen, my whole message is just go on your journey. Like I always keep saying, like, become the CEO of your own healthcare journey. You know, become your own advocate. And when you do, then, you know, miracles can happen, as I know they did for me. Like, because one point I want to make that's really important that prior to getting to that point, point of like, there's a very key moment. I just want to touch on this for a second. When I was about nine years into my lithium journey, I was still, even though I was going on the journey and going on healing, I was so much in a victim mentality. But the thing that switched and switched everything for me is I started, I woke up one day, I was like, I'm tired of this. You know, what are these symptoms here to teach me? And I kept focusing on that. What are these symptoms Here to teach me. And that's when everything shifted. Universe conspired. Healers, therapists, shamans, all sort of coming into my life.
[00:31:46] Speaker A: The shift from fix me or fix
[00:31:48] Speaker C: it into I'm a victim, poor me.
[00:31:51] Speaker A: What do these symptoms mean?
[00:31:52] Speaker C: Wine. Wine, Wine.
[00:31:52] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:31:53] Speaker C: To. All right, let's be proactive. What is this? Here to teach me? And then all these incredible people came in, so I got to tour it 2013 to 2015.
And it was during that time that you and I met through the film. Yep.
[00:32:07] Speaker A: Yeah. That's how my. My marketing woman found out about you and the mental health project.
[00:32:11] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:32:12] Speaker A: Brought us together.
[00:32:12] Speaker C: So. So I think. Yeah. Remember you saw the film, came in, saw you in Toronto, and, you know, and that was such a bless. First of all, just meeting his brothers. Instant brothers. I remember when I first walked in the door. But also, secondly, you know, you introduced me to the somatic work, and that was a big turning point for me in my life.
[00:32:27] Speaker A: I'm jumping real quick just for viewers. Somatic work. Soma is the Greek, the Latin word for body, and it just simply means being able to take what we're thinking about and talking about and look at how our body is carrying that.
So, yeah, that's what happened, was Ross and I met around the film, and then we felt an instant connection. And I invited you into somatic training at a. At a clinical level.
[00:32:48] Speaker C: Yeah. And it was. It was incredible. It was perfect timing. It was right when I was starting to think about doing coaching and doing this work. The film piece had kind of ended, and it was just such an extraordinary journey because I know with the somatic work.
And that's the thing, right? It was.
There was a doctor in the film, Dr. Charles Whitfield, and he said, you know, 30 years of practice.
What I see consistently in all mental health issues is there's always a core of trauma, whether it's big or small.
There's a core trauma that's dysregulating the nervous system that then gets attached to all the spectrum of the labels and the challenges that come with it.
So, you know, started to do the work. I was actually living in Costa Rica at the time of flying in for these quarterly visits with our, you know, our dear mentors and brothers, Michael and Jeff.
And it was just so. Well, you know, I want to tell a quick story that I was. I just had my daughter. I was, like, 40. Just my daughter. She's a baby girl. Babies whine and complain and cry, and I was still so dysregulated within My own nervous system that I was having a hard time holding my daughter that I adore love.
I went to this first training and everyone did a piece of work. It was very experiential. You did some theory, but then Saturday and Sundays, you're in the hot seat, you're doing the work. And I remember doing this huge piece of work. I can't even remember what it was, but it was just like it was rage that was just flooding out of my body. Because this work is very much. You're moving your body, you're getting into the experience, removing that energy out of the body that was then on the underneath, the rage was just grief. And I just remember I was like in a puddle of tears. I had like 16 other practitioners, the two facilitators, like, holding me at the end of this. And that is the magic of this work, is that you, like, you have it literally the heart heals in real time. So I left, flew back to Costa Rica. My baby girl, who's just a few months old, is having a tantrum. And my wife Monica watches me go and like pick her up for the first time. I'm holding my baby girl. She's like, oh my God, whatever you just did, I'm in. And she actually signed up for the training too, you know.
[00:34:43] Speaker B: Wow.
[00:34:43] Speaker A: So you could see that case example is so perfect. What a quick turnaround.
[00:34:47] Speaker C: This works.
[00:34:47] Speaker A: Within one weekend of an experience, you were able to help yourself gain the capacities to be. Be able to tolerate a screaming baby.
[00:34:53] Speaker C: A little layer left and my nervous system settles a bit more. And so there was. So it was just training after training like that, just going deeper and deeper. And so that was such a huge piece for me. Not only to be able to do the work and then to be able to practice the work and then to be able to the other side and support people moving through that. It's just been, you know, such incredible, you know, and just when you and I have done it together, like, it's like. Yeah, it's like a. It's like this.
I don't know, it's like this altered space and time. And you just. You see how quickly people can like literally recover themselves, reclaim their energy.
[00:35:26] Speaker A: Because it's not just a mental construct, but is actually neurological, neuromuscular. It's how. How we live and move and breathe in our body.
[00:35:33] Speaker C: And.
[00:35:34] Speaker A: No, I love everything you're bringing here. Obviously, this is my. One of my favorite things ever to talk about somatic work. And so I also just want to highlight too, Ross, that You know, so beautiful that, you know, you continue to have the courage to pay it forward and also, even with just help our viewers continue to understand. It's an example where we can intellectually know something and talk about it a thousand times over. But until we really look at how that belief structure or that painful memory holds on into our. In our body through contraction, then we're just going to keep repeating it. And so often, you know, not just Ross or many parents, I humbly admitted as a parent as well, that anything that we haven't healed in our own childhood, when we become parents, it will come up in some way, shape or
[00:36:15] Speaker C: form in your face.
[00:36:16] Speaker A: Say like, yeah, you're not comfortable with that. Why is that? You know, so thank you for doing the work and continue to step up. And that's another theme you bring up, is that this has come, many guests now continue to re. Highlight this is that by knowing ourselves, we will lead with heart, naturally. In other words. Right. Any part of us that isn't hopefully isn't processed and it's still holding on to the shadows that's going to show up in our leadership whether we can't show up how we want as a dad or whether we yell at somebody in the office because we're holding a lot of tension and we yelled at somebody that didn't deserve it.
[00:36:50] Speaker C: And I want to make the point, too, Jesse, that we say this a lot. The work is never done. The work continues. You know, humbly say that the work continues. There's no, there's no. You don't arrive and it's just, oh, joy, oh, bliss. Because life is always going to present things.
However, the one thing I've been really practicing and learning recently, which I love so much, is that to not take on anyone else's storms and guards my joy like the jewel that it is.
[00:37:18] Speaker A: Guard my joy like the jewel it is.
[00:37:20] Speaker C: And that has really been a major shift because, yeah, there's like, lots of people can have storms. You know, I used to just take on the storm and then that would just regulate me. And next, you know, I'm like all upset and I'm like, wait a second. That had nothing to do with it.
[00:37:33] Speaker A: And it comes from a good place. Right. Like, it's still that same guy from the beginning of your story that just wanted to help totally. But it can end up hurting us. And ultimately, yeah, we can actually, you know, disable people by helping too much.
[00:37:44] Speaker C: Right? Yeah.
[00:37:46] Speaker A: Wow. Man. No, no, I, I appreciate this so much, Ross. And I, I wonder too, if you could go into a little bit more just around, you know, that was something there with your daughter. What about as you. You know, again, just to remind myself and viewers like, this is a story where you should have, could have, would have just been another number on a piece of paper from a guy who's been medicated his whole life and had such great potential, but became somewhat of a zombie. Right. And so first of all, let's just honor that. Honor you. That's amazing. I know you're not the only one out there that has the story or needs this story.
And just for our viewers to bring it full forward like that, this is the lotus as being able to go from a place where you're literally in a straitjacket being told you're messed up forever, to here you are. And I remember even when we first met, you know, you were. You were just started starting to come out as. As your new self. And how amazing to look at the ways in which you stepping into that not only for yourself, but what it set in tone for your family ahead of you, what it sets in tone for people that you can help. And now here you are all these years later, having already created the film, which is amazing. And we'll. Before the show wraps, we'll make sure people now to find the film. Yeah. But also that you know that to acknowledge you are now a certified coach and you support others through many different sorts of processes and even down here in Costa Rica. So I wonder if you want to say anything about just. Yeah. What it is for you now, having been the identified patient to now being the coach, the healer. What's that like?
[00:39:13] Speaker C: Oh, I mean, it's amazing because it's always, I think, just because I walked it and I lived it, you know, I think that the fortunate part about that is when I work with people is just that it's just that part's embodied like people can. People can see that, people can feel that. So I'm just. I think I'm just able to really, truly meet people that are like, hey, you know, if they're going through something similar, I've actually been there and I know where that's at and there's a way through this. And so I think just being able to sit in that place and just know that that on its own just provides a lot of hope, I find. Makes the work a lot easier, you know, because it's just people really, people just for the most part need hope and sometimes when they're not even feeling that. So, yeah, it's just It's, I just feel tremendous gratitude. I remember the first time because you gave me my first opportunity to do some coaching work. And I remember I was like, I was excited, I was terrified.
But it was just, it was this extraordinary fairness. I think probably in the first day where I'm like, I'm waiting for the clients arrived, I'm like sitting in the other chair now. It was just such a moment of like, wow, this is so cool. I can just sit in the other chair. I get to now, like pay it forward. And so I just always humbled by it and always super grateful by doing the work.
[00:40:26] Speaker A: If that's not a good example of a lotus, I don't know what is.
[00:40:28] Speaker C: Right.
[00:40:29] Speaker A: Going from to the other, to the other chair.
[00:40:30] Speaker C: Right.
[00:40:31] Speaker A: And so. Well, no, Ross, thank you again, man, for your beautiful vulnerability here and the courage to keep doing this work. And after this break, we're going to come back and we're going to dive into the harvest, which is really extracting the wisdom of this story that's applicable
[00:40:44] Speaker B: for all of us.
[00:40:44] Speaker A: So stay tuned. We'll be back soon.
[00:40:51] Speaker B: We'll be right back with more insight stories and practices to help you lead from your whole self. This is Lead with Heart on NOW via television.
Leadership isn't just about decisions. It's about presence, compassion and courage.
I'm Dr. Jesse Hanson, somatic psychologist and healer. And on Lead with Heart we explore what happens when we lead with awareness, compassion and the body in mind.
From brain health to relational intelligence, from trauma informed leadership to embodied teams, each episode reveals a deeper way to lead.
Lead with Heart is airing now on NowMedia TV. Because the greatest leaders don't just guide people, they awaken them.
[00:41:41] Speaker A: And we're back.
[00:41:42] Speaker B: I'm Dr. Jesse Hansen and you're watching Lead with Heart on Now Media Television. Let's continue embracing leadership with presence and purpose.
[00:41:52] Speaker A: Welcome back to Lead with Heart. You want to stay tuned to Lead with Heart and all your NOW media favorites. Please don't forget to download the app on iOS or Android. You can find us on Apple TV Roku. If you prefer podcasts, we're on all the major platforms so please stay connected. We've got you covered. Getting back here now to Lead with Heart in Dualia in Dominical, Costa Rica with my dear friend, brother and colleague, Ross McKenzie. What a story you are sharing. And you know what, before make sure I don't forget. If we could just kick this segment off, if you don't mind. Just let viewers know if they want to check out your film. What's the best way to find it online.
[00:42:28] Speaker C: Okay. So the film's called by Polarized. You can find the trailer online.
It's a little tricky. So on itunes and Amazon in the states, you can get it. So if you have a vpn, if you're outside the states, you can get it.
[00:42:41] Speaker B: Well, what is.
[00:42:41] Speaker C: What is the website also? Well, so first off. Yeah. So on itunes and Amazon, you can purchase the film. Okay. It's not. You can't purchase film on my website because it's through a distribution company.
So. Yeah, so that's the way to go about it. Itunes and Amazon through the states and
[00:42:56] Speaker A: just Google or search bipolarized.
[00:42:58] Speaker C: Yeah. And I would say too, if you're in another part of the world, which happens all the time, and I've had a lot of people reach out, so frustrated they can't purchase it.
Reach out to me direct through my website, Ross McKenzie dot com. R, O S S M C K E N Z I e dot com.
Send me a message and I'll send you a private link because I want.
[00:43:17] Speaker A: You want it to be seen to be seen.
[00:43:19] Speaker C: Yeah. That was some of the frustrating parts of, like, the business side of things, like. Well, it's filmed for people to see it.
[00:43:24] Speaker A: Yeah. And I feel like as a mental health professional for 25 years, I would also say, you know, your film was released in 2014 and 2013. 2013. Sorry.
[00:43:32] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:43:32] Speaker A: Point is. Yeah. Long ago. And I feel like it was ahead of its time and I feel like now many more people are actually willing to hear these messages and look deeper and understand things that you outlined, you know, 12 years ago. So please know. Yeah, that's a great way to stay in touch with Ross and even learn more about his amazing story in incredible cinematic cinematography.
So to bring this episode home and to honor this segment, which is known as the Harvest. The Harvest is really about reaping what we have sown and looking at how we pay it forward. So we just heard that here you are, Ross, someone that was told by doctors that you'd be on lithium and basically have very little to do in your own life. You know, when you were young adult, you know, post teen. And here you are now, living in Costa Rica with a beautiful life, a beautiful wife, two children, living in paradise, helping out other people. Continue to do your own work.
So I want you to trust yourself in opening up the wisdom that you walk with now as well as please share with us anything else you're dreaming awake for yourself, for your family, for this community.
[00:44:37] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:44:38] Speaker A: What do you Want to see happen here in the next steps of your journey? Sure.
[00:44:41] Speaker C: Well, I mean, one thing, it's exciting to share. So, yeah, you talked about. I had so many people say with a film, gosh, your film's ahead of its time because it kind of came out and then it fizzled and. But the cool thing was, is that I ended up getting invited to be interviewed for this podcast. This gentleman from the Czech Republic, he flew me out to Joshua Tree in January, this past January, had this great interview. We hit it off and he's just this kind soul. He's like, you know, mathematician genius. It's like, Ross, if we don't have free speech in the world, we're screwed. So his whole mission now is making sure that till his last breath, we have free speech for all of humanity. No if, ands or buts. And then he says to me, listen, I watched your film while I was preparing for our interview. I loved it so much. He goes, I'm offering. It's now being translated into Czech.
And he's flying me out to Prague once it's translated and he's going to screen it in Prague. And it's just. I'm just cracking up. It's like it was 2:13, we did it, and here we are in two.
[00:45:36] Speaker A: Barely get any traction.
[00:45:37] Speaker C: And I feel like it's like, yeah, it's now going to find some new homes.
[00:45:40] Speaker A: So.
[00:45:41] Speaker C: So that's one thing that's coming up I'm so excited about.
It's just a gem of a guy.
[00:45:46] Speaker A: Part of it is going to Czech the Prague. But it's also just the, the, the message back from the universe that, yeah, somewhat people are ready to hear this message now.
[00:45:53] Speaker C: Yeah.
[00:45:54] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:45:55] Speaker C: So. So that one and some of the other things in Germany awake too, that just, just landed. But I'm so excited about. So there's this website called theheartysoul.com I'm partnered with the creator of that, and I'm creating a mental wellness course and series. And I'm just in the process of building that and producing that. And so that will probably be. It's gonna take a couple months to do, but I'm just, to me, it's just like kind of distilling down all the aspects of, you know, the things that have worked and just planting seeds. So for anyone that wants to, you know, go to that website, I'd say probably by like, September, there's going to be a ton of, you know, chapters.
[00:46:33] Speaker A: The hearty soul.
[00:46:34] Speaker C: Thehardysoul.com is this gentleman, his name is Mohammed. Great dude. And so, yeah, we're co producing that together. So that's going to be coming out. And yeah, I get so excited about just sharing this information.
To me, that's where, you know, that's what fuels my soul at this point.
[00:46:52] Speaker A: Yeah, beautiful man. Yeah.
[00:46:53] Speaker C: And.
[00:46:54] Speaker A: And what do you. What are you feeling about. Yeah, just wisdom that you walk with now and.
[00:46:59] Speaker C: Well, I think I said it a little bit earlier and say, like, I, I just, I wake up every day, you know, let me just share some of the practices that are so important to me. Like, I wake up every day, first of all, being grateful for the day, being grateful for my breath, being grateful for my life. I just feel like I'm just in this constant gratitude loop that is now a practice. And one of the things that is this gentleman, Dr. Christopher Macklin, a few years ago I was working with him and he just instilled this into me of just like, you know, waking up. And I love the word he gives to it because he takes any religious tone out of it. And I don't mind the word prayer, but he calls them maps of intent.
[00:47:39] Speaker A: Maps of intent.
[00:47:39] Speaker C: Maps of intent. So waking up in the morning and the first thing I do is praying to God and then invoking my day and invoking how I want it to be, and invoking how I want it to be with my family and invoking how I want it to be with my friends and my colleagues and my projects and, you know, and so it is. And commanding that. And since I started that practice of I commands, you know, because we all have that power to command, because we all have that spark and inside of us that's connected to all of it. And so since doing that, that one little practice, like if there's something you just impart to the listeners, you start that little practice. And I also might add, too, Put it in your water.
Hold the prayers, put the prayers into the water. And then when you finish, drink the prayers into your body and into your cells, which I also feel like amplifies the prayers.
So, you know, those are some of the. That's like one of the practices that I've worked with. I feel like that if I just did that only, you know, life has been like, it's magical. Even when, you know, the proverbial.
[00:48:45] Speaker A: Yeah, yeah, yeah, challenges come, right? Yeah. Turns into lotuses. Yeah.
[00:48:49] Speaker C: Being able to, like, you know, I, I love now that when the challenges come, I love being able to meet them the same level of grace and love that, that a good Day is, you know, like, all right, here's a challenge. So it's like really enjoying the adventure of it. And it's just knowing that when I do that invocation in the morning before I start my day, it's like, all right, I'm fully supported, I'm fully guided.
[00:49:11] Speaker A: Yeah, beautiful.
[00:49:12] Speaker C: And yeah, that's been, that's been game changing for me, that practice.
[00:49:15] Speaker A: I feel like, yeah, maybe help ground that wisdom is like, whether it's, you know, for you, you found what works for you. The invocations, prayers, commands, I love that.
But it's the art of some kind of ritual. And this is again, as a huge promoter of ancient wisdom, bringing. Brought into our modern world, you know, as simple as just. Yeah. Whether it's meditation, prayer, whether it's movements. But I do know, and I know you brought up Tony Robbins earlier. Like, I've heard interviews with him and stuff, and that he does, he does some pretty wild things before, I think every day, but especially before his big events. He's totally banging on his chest. Jumping on a trampoline. Jumping on a trampoline. Yeah. You know, I think that's something else that I want to reinforce. This idea of leading with heart means that it doesn't all happen in our head. And so many, especially corporate leaders, but all different types of leaders, there's so many things to do and figure out that it's so easy to get trapped in our head. But developing these rituals that bring us into our body, that can be done, you know, ideally at the beginning of the day, but even on little breaks, I humbly admit, you know, I, I didn't realize as such that I've been using as I got trained those 25 years ago. But those are things that also help me. Even if it's just like you said, it's not even just about your job, it's about how you show up as a father, it's how you show up as a husband.
[00:50:24] Speaker C: Right. So, yeah, like, are you embodied in all those aspects? Like, is the person that you show up to work and your client, are you bringing that same level of authenticity and forgiveness into your home and with your family? You know, and when all of that gets, you know, when all that becomes solidified, then that's, you know, it's a really beautiful place to be.
[00:50:42] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:50:43] Speaker C: Yeah. And, you know, I'm glad what you said about the embodied piece, because so interesting when I think back to like, I was living in a different part of Costa Rica here during my 40s, and I didn't Have a lot of exercise. And you know, I had an athletic background. I get here to this part of the country and I was so excited, like, oh, there's a court. And so I used to be a tennis player my whole life. Now I'm a pickleball player.
Leaving this interview, I'm going right to the pickleball court. And I love that, that's like that flow state and challenging myself. It's like having that back in my life. I'm realizing there was a part of me that during my 40s, like felt like I was dying not having that piece. But it's the embodiment piece, it's the movement, it's the, you know, it's getting the blood flowing and getting that thing going.
[00:51:19] Speaker A: And now as you, as you say, all that I humbly admit and can feel like where I'm so out of balance in my life because I, I, yeah, doing athletics like that, like the idea of going down in the middle of the day and rocking an hour of pickleball or whatever, it would be right. There's something about finding ways to get us into our body, into the things that challenge us, bring us present and then that carries over into how we show up the rest of the day in our meetings or everything else. Right. Whereas for constantly, and I know this, a lot happens, a lot of leaders, we get caught in the doing, the burden, the left brain and the feeling of duty, the feeling of constant responsibility.
And then we forget to play and we forget to drop into our bodies and challenge ourselves. And so I appreciate you bringing that. That is for sure wisdom and that is, it's, it sounds so simple just to say I, I need to remember to go, you know, work out and stretch or whatever it is. And yet to realize that impacts the whole rest of our day is a powerful technique for leaders.
[00:52:17] Speaker C: And I love you said the play, the play piece, the most important. We came here as humans to play. And I have this beautiful, beautiful human mentor who said to me last week, and I love what he says, he's like, if you're with a 10 year old, you're 9 years old.
If you're with a 6 years old, you're 5 years old and let them lead. And like blows my mind.
[00:52:42] Speaker A: Yeah.
[00:52:42] Speaker C: And I like and I as much as I can with my kids, who's a 13 year old daughter and a 10 year old son. I like, I bring that in.
[00:52:48] Speaker A: So you're 12 and nine, is that right? Yeah, you're 12 and nine, you're with them. Right.
[00:52:52] Speaker C: And I love it because I can see them. They're like, daddy, you're so silly and kind of nutty and like, it is the best thing to hear from my kids when they say that.
[00:52:59] Speaker A: That's so beautiful, man. Beautiful. Well, well. Now, in the spirit of play, I don't want to hold you back from your pickleball game, so we are going to properly pause this episode now. Ross, I just want to thank you so much for coming in and sharing your story. And you always inspire me, man. I am so touched and excited to see what you're dreaming awake next beyond what you already know of. Now, like, I know good things are going to keep coming your way. So thanks from thank you so much for being here today.
[00:53:23] Speaker C: Thanks for having me. Yeah.
[00:53:24] Speaker A: And thank you, everyone, for staying tuned to lead with heart here on NOW Media tv. There'll be plenty more beautiful, heartfelt stories and vulnerable shares coming up, so stay tuned for more. Create a beautiful, blessed life. And as we say down here in Costa Rica, Pura Vira, live the pure life.
